[Vtigercrm-developers] no answer and no commits on code.vtiger.com since weeks?!

[Ing. Francesco Bianco]

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    \__/  \__/ /__/     \__\ |__|\__\ |_______|    \______/  | _|      (__)



Il giorno ven 22 lug 2022 alle ore 23:31 Mariusz Krzaczkowski | YetiForce
S.A. <m.krzaczkowski at yetiforce.com> ha scritto:

> Hello,
> At the request of "Rubén Alberto Estrada Orozco <rulo at simplesistemas.com>"
> I am writing this e-mail. This is just my point of view of the current
> situation.
>
> I've looked at YetiForce a couple of times (not massively in-depth) and to
> be honest if it had EmailMaker and PDFMaker (from Its4You team)
>
> Our system has similar / alternative functionalities, I do not know if
> they have 100% the same functionalities but fulfill the same functions.
>
> that we basically install it in all our new CRMs by default now. So to
> switch to something that doesn't have the same functionality is much harder
> to sell to clients. (even if behind the scenes its 10x better!)
>
> We added them to the system because these are the basic mechanisms that
> the system should have.
>
> Hmmm, hadn't seen that before – checking out the licence for the software
> says this :
> Data used for registration must be true. All provided registration
> information, including the company's name, can be used by YetiForce Sp. z
> o.o. (Ltd.) for marketing purposes | (i.e. preparation of statistics,
> publication on the website).
> Not sure how I feel about having to provide this information for
> open-source software.
>
> Thanks to this, we can better understand which companies / countries /
> industries use our system.
> This helps us determine what to expand in the system first, and more.
> It may be strange for some people, but this is something in return for our
> work, we give a great system for free and we only want data that is public
> anyway.
> There is nothing confidential there.
>
> My main concern then becomes that we cannot guarantee that the software
> will work – ONLY if Yetiforce accept the registration, and what happens if
> the project gets abandoned? Can it be registered without Yetiforce servers??
>
> Don't worry about this because:
> - no registration does not block CRM
> - our server is not obligatory for registration
> - offline registration can be made when someone does not have Internet on
> the server
> - We do not plan to abandon the project, we invest a lot of money / time
> in it, so why should we abandon it?
> - currently the company has changed into a joint-stock company and we go
> public, this is not what the company that wants to abandon the project does
> - from version 6.2 there is a new simplified license,
> https://github.com/YetiForceCompany/YetiForceCRM/blob/developer/licenses/LicenseEN.txt
>
> - Remember this Open Source together we can do more
>
> A good point could be to create a Community Contributed version of Vtiger.
> Something that stays true to the original version but accepts small
> independent contributions and bug support.
>
> It will not work, I thought similarly a few years ago. Our system started
> to be completely different from vtiger.
> We had to make a lot of changes to make the system more efficient and
> flexible.
> What made it different from the original vtiger is a natural evolution.
> Every developing system does it, otherwise it dies.
>
> My biggest fear is that if Composer support is not introduced soon, the
> software will neither be upgradeable nor usable at a professional level.
>
> It was our first big step, this change was painful because it required
> updating many libraries.
> And some of them are not supported / developed / safe anymore, so we had
> to replace them with newer ones.
> This is proof that vtiger does not care about Open Source and security.
> Any serious project uses the centralization of libraries otherwise it is
> impossible to control them.
> The development is so fast and there are so many changes in PHP and
> libraries that it necessitates continuous development of the project.
> Composer has been around since 2012 and we already have 2022, think about
> it.
>
> For me Workflow Designer from Redoo networks is crucial.
>
> We have a lot of new and improved mechanisms that work similarly or even
> better than the "Workflow Designer".
> I do not know what there is that is not with us, it would require a
> careful comparison.
>
> This is what is needed – however I am realistic in that either the whole
> (or majority of) vTiger open-source community needs to migrate to a
> Community version OR it just becomes another fork.
>
> There are many forks, vtiger is a fork too.
> Many of them have died or are barely alive.
> Without a strong / active community or someone who lives on the project,
> there is no future.
>
> vTiger themselves clearly don't' want to implement the functionality that
> we're all asking for, as they have no business need to – ultimately they
> are selling their own vTiger version that doesn't have/need to e.g. use
> Composer unless they want it to.
>
> We used to try to talk to the vtiger team to join forces and create a
> strong / safe / modern design but they weren't interested, they don't need
> anybody to help.
> That's why we made a fork and we don't regret it, it was the best decision.
> If we had stayed with them we wouldn't have gotten as far as we are now,
> they were limiting ours every step of the way by creating additions, they
> didn't want help developing the engine to make it more flexible.
>
> So where does that leave us? Stuck between a rock and a hard place –
> no-one will migrate unless everyone else migrates...so who goes first?
> And then whose in charge of the new community version? Whoever setups a
> repo in GitHub first?
> The ideal solution in my eyes would be to have a body of people
> responsible for driving the direction of the project, who represent the
> community, and are responsible for managing the pull-requests etc.
>
> Your decision, you can stay and wait for a better tomorrow or go ahead and
> take the project into your own hands.
>
> I know there was an attempt to fork vtiger a few years back. Later it was
> decided to stay with vtiger open source. Because there were too many
> similar CRMs already in the market already including Yeti and suite. Anyway
> the Open Source progress is very slow.
>
> It all depends on the society and the project manager, choose the best one.
> It is known that changes are painful at the beginning, you have to look
> where we will be in a month / year / years, not one day.
> If we thought so, we would stand still or even move backwards because
> today the pace of technology development is enormous.
> I remember vtiger 11 years ago, when I started working, they tried to take
> care of open source development now it's gone.
>
> The infrastructure roadmap should be considered on the other side, which
> is seriously diverted to cloud at the moment.
>
> Sad but true, and the same for years
>
> Developing a support system using modern stacks such as MERN or MEAN or
> using PHP frameworks such as Phalcon or Laravel becomes relatively easier
>  than forking and evolving  a monolithic. So we have to consider how to
> contribute to an open source project efficiently to meet the future.
>
> Big words, requiring a lot of work, the question of who will do it, there
> are few willing ...
>
> I suggest, separating the frontend and backend, similar to the Magento
> (Now Adobe commerce) PWA storefront, would be the best approach to migrate
> to modern platforms. Vtiger commercial may derive the benefits from this
> approach.
>
> You can see that it does not matter for vtiger, they do not need it, their
> cloud solutions require dedicated solutions and integrated with their
> profit model.
> I agree with you the separation of frontend and backend, only that it
> requires changes of the entire architecture and no one sees business bones
> in it.
> This is expensive with an existing engine and an upgrade would be painful.
> Business sees it differently, unless you have generous sponsors.
>
>
> *"Life is the Matrix - which pill do you choose?"*
> --
> Z poważaniem / Kind regards
> Mariusz Krzaczkowski
> Director of Product Development
> +48 884 998 123 | m.krzaczkowski at yetiforce.com
> www.yetiforce.com <http://yetiforce.com>
>
> [image: YetiForce] [image: linkedin]
> <https://linkedin.com/company/yetiforce> [image: facebook]
> <https://facebook.com/YetiForceCRM/> [image: twitter]
> <https://twitter.com/yetiforceen> [image: youtube]
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnt7DLyYtcSBkC2sk2CJBXw> [image: github]
> <https://github.com/YetiForceCompany/YetiForceCRM>
> [image: Nagrody / Awards: HIGH PERFORMER IN CRM CATEGORY, MOST AFFORDABLE
> CRM SYSTEM IN THE WORLD IN 2017, SUPPLIER OF THE YEAR 2017 IN THE IT
> CATEGORY, GUARANTEE OF USER SATISFACTION, RISING STAR AMONG CRM SYSTEMS,
> PLATINIUM MEDAL FROM THE SENSIOLABINSIGHTS]
> The content of this message is confidential and must not be disclosed. If
> the recipient of this message is not the intended recipient, employee, or
> intermediary authorized to forward it to the intended recipient, please
> note that all distribution, copying, or any other use of this message is
> forbidden. If you received this message by mistake, please inform the
> sender immediately by responding to this message, and delete all copies of
> this message.
>
>
> W dniu 2022-07-22 20:01, Angelo Paglialonga napisał(a):
>
> Hi Martin,
> we could start with a GitHub repository merging fixes for current bugs, so
> that our businesses  don't get too affected from these periods of "silence"
> from vtiger team.
> Who would be comfortable with this?
>
> *Dott. Angelo Paglialonga*
> *Consulenza vTiger CRM ad alto ROI.*
>
> *Telefono: 338.6077866*
>
>
> Il giorno 18 lug 2022, alle ore 15:43, Martin Allen <
> martin.allen at exe-squared.co.uk> ha scritto:
>
> This is what is needed – however I am realistic in that either the whole
> (or majority of) vTiger open-source community needs to migrate to a
> Community version OR it just becomes *another* fork.
> Like I said previously without the functionality of some key plugins, we
> wouldn't migrate (unless we found a client willing to pay for us to develop
> our own version of it in a new CRM!)
>
> vTiger themselves clearly don't' want to implement the functionality that
> we're all asking for, as they have no business need to – ultimately they
> are selling their own vTiger version that doesn't have/need to e.g. use
> Composer unless they want it to.
>
> So where does that leave us? Stuck between a rock and a hard place –
> no-one will migrate unless everyone else migrates...so who goes first?
> And then whose in charge of the new community version? Whoever setups a
> repo in GitHub first?
> The ideal solution in my eyes would be to have a body of people
> responsible for driving the direction of the project, who represent the
> community, and are responsible for managing the pull-requests etc. But that
> roles currently being done (when they are allowed to!) by paid employees of
> vTiger...
>
> *From:* vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com <
> vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com> *On Behalf Of *Ing.
> Francesco Bianco
> *Sent:* 18 July 2022 13:54
> *To:* vtigercrm-developers at lists.vtigercrm.com
> *Subject:* Re: [Vtigercrm-developers] no answer and no commits on
> code.vtiger.comsince weeks?!
>
> A good point could be to create a Community Contributed version of Vtiger.
> Something that stays true to the original version but accepts small
> independent contributions and bug support.
> My biggest fear is that if Composer support is not introduced soon, the
> software will neither be upgradeable nor usable at a professional level.
>
> Il giorno lun 18 lug 2022 alle ore 14:36 Matus Sopko <sopko at its4you.sk>
> ha scritto:
>
> First thanks to Martin ;-)
> Second, what we don't like in Yeti is the registration process:
> https://yetiforce.com/en/marketplace/system-registration
>
>
> Best regards / Mit freundlichen Grüßen
>
> Matus
>
> IT-Solutions4You (ITS4You)
>
>
>
> SLOVAKIA
>
> Dňa 18. 7. 2022 o 13:51 Martin Allen napísal(a):
>
> I've looked at YetiForce a couple of times (not massively in-depth) and to
> be honest if it had EmailMaker and PDFMaker (from Its4You team) then I'd be
> looking at it as a realistic alternative – currently those two plugins
> allow our end-users so much additional functionality that customers want,
> that we basically install it in all our new CRMs by default now. So to
> switch to something that doesn't have the same functionality is much harder
> to sell to clients. (even if behind the scenes its 10x better!)
>
> *From:* vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com
> <vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com>
> <vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com> *On Behalf Of *Rubén
> A. Estrada Orozco
> *Sent:* 15 July 2022 18:33
> *To:* vtigercrm-developers at lists.vtigercrm.com
> *Subject:* Re: [Vtigercrm-developers] no answer and no commits on
> code.vtiger.com since weeks?!
>
> Have you guys considered this alternative?:
> https://github.com/YetiForceCompany/YetiForceCRM/commits/developer
> There have been DAiLY commits for a long time.
>
> I don't mean to disrespect anybody. It's really an honest question. I'm
> really interested in what you think about Yeti.
>
> Saludos
>
> Rubén
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 15, 2022 at 11:49 AM Sutharsan J <ajstharsan at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi
>
> Thinks are going on here eh?
> https://code.vtiger.com/vtiger/vtigercrm/tree/master
>
> Last commit was 2 months ago?
>
>
> Thanks
> Sutharsan Jeganathan
>
> On Fri, Jul 15, 2022 at 8:10 PM Martin Allen <
> martin.allen at exe-squared.co.uk> wrote:
>
> https://github.com/vtiger-crm/vtigercrm
>
> It looks a little bit out of date though...... 😊
>
> *From:* vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com<
> vtigercrm-developers-bounces at lists.vtigercrm.com> *On Behalf Of *Ing.
> Francesco Bianco
> *Sent:* 15 July 2022 12:46
> *To:* vtigercrm-developers at lists.vtigercrm.com
> *Subject:* Re: [Vtigercrm-developers] no answer and no commits on
> code.vtiger.com since weeks?!
>
> Good point BUT having an official place on GitHub is an important
> placeholder.
> Many software not use GitHub as a primary source, BUT at the same time
> have a GitHub presence with a MIRROR
>
> This is the mirror of popular make tool from SAVANNAH directory on GitHub
> https://github.com/mirror/make
>
> I say ENOUGH accusing the VTIGER team, let's roll up our sleeves and
> create something ourselves. Let's give a modern touch to this project. It
> is unforgivable that even today CI or Docker or simply PHP Code Sniffer are
> not used to detect unused variables. But we want to wake up!
>
>
>
>
> Il giorno gio 14 lug 2022 alle ore 19:00 Rubén A. Estrada Orozco <
> rulotec1 at gmail.com> ha scritto:
>
> Because they chose to host their own GitLab open source platform. In my
> opinion GitHub would be better.
>
> Saludos
>
> Rubén
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 14, 2022 at 10:38 AM Ing. Francesco Bianco <
> info.francescobianco at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Why does Vtiger have NO official place on GitHub?
>
> Il giorno gio 14 lug 2022 alle ore 17:08 lajeesh k <lajeeshk at gmail.com>
> ha scritto:
>
> The whole vtiger community should get nominated for the Nobel prize for
> partiance.
>
> Regards,
> Lajeesh
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, 24 Jun 2022 at 21:05, Rubén A. Estrada Orozco <rulotec1 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> +2 (me and my dog)
> Saludos
>
> Rubén
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 24, 2022 at 7:10 AM socialboostdk <socialboostdk at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> +1
>
> / Chris
> [image: 4]
>
> On Fri, 24 Jun 2022 at 10:59, Vincenzo Bruno <v.bruno at vinsoft.it> wrote:
>
> UP
> Il 14/06/22 13:02, Angelo Paglialonga ha scritto:
>
> Hi @Prasad,
> there is too much silence on vtiger open source since weeks:
>
> no replies to any questions on newsletter,
> no answer on any issues and merge request
> no merge requests answered
> no news about vtiger 7.5 release
>
> If you don't have time just let someone in community do it.
> We would like to help you, but this way it doesn't work, it's just
> pointless.
> Best Regards
>
>
> *Dott. Angelo Paglialonga*
> *Consulenza vTiger CRM ad alto ROI.*
>
> *Telefono: 338.6077866*
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
> --
>
>
>
> Vincenzo Bruno (cell. 328-7252923)
>
> Coopyleft (www.vinsoft.it/coopyleft)
>
> Digital Polis (www.digitalpolis.it)
>
> Hacklab Cosenza (www.hlcs.it)
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
>
> --
> *Ing. Francesco Bianco*
> Senior Software Engineer, CRM Solution Architect
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>   email: info.francescobianco at gmail.com
>     pec: info.francescobianco at pec.it
>    blog: https://medium.com/@yafb
>    sito: https://italia.codecrm.org
>  social: https://linkedin.com/in/yafb
>  mobile: +39 320 0466987
>   p.iva: 02360350819
>
> --
> Ai sensi del D.L. n° 196 del 30/06/03 si precisa che le informazioni
> contenute
> in questo messaggio sono riservate e ad uso esclusivo del destinatario.
> Qualora il messaggio Le fosse pervenuto per errore La preghiamo di
> eliminarlo
> senza copiarlo, e di non inviarlo a terzi, dandocene gentilmente
> comunicazione.
> Grazie.
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
>
> --
> *Ing. Francesco Bianco*
> Senior Software Engineer, CRM Solution Architect
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>   email: info.francescobianco at gmail.com
>     pec: info.francescobianco at pec.it
>    blog: https://medium.com/@yafb
>    sito: https://italia.codecrm.org
>  social: https://linkedin.com/in/yafb
>  mobile: +39 320 0466987
>   p.iva: 02360350819
>
> --
> Ai sensi del D.L. n° 196 del 30/06/03 si precisa che le informazioni
> contenute
> in questo messaggio sono riservate e ad uso esclusivo del destinatario.
> Qualora il messaggio Le fosse pervenuto per errore La preghiamo di
> eliminarlo
> senza copiarlo, e di non inviarlo a terzi, dandocene gentilmente
> comunicazione.
> Grazie.
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
>
> --
> Development Manager
> Radus28 Software Solution
>
> 123, Level 2, Mc Larens Building
> Baudhaloka Mw.
> Colombo 04
> Sri Lanka
> M : +94773795291
> E  : sutharsan at radus28.com
> W : www.radus28.com
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
>
> --
> *Ing. Francesco Bianco*
> Senior Software Engineer, CRM Solution Architect
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>   email: info.francescobianco at gmail.com
>     pec: info.francescobianco at pec.it
>    blog: https://medium.com/@yafb
>    sito: https://italia.codecrm.org
>  social: https://linkedin.com/in/yafb
>  mobile: +39 320 0466987
>   p.iva: 02360350819
>
> --
> Ai sensi del D.L. n° 196 del 30/06/03 si precisa che le informazioni
> contenute
> in questo messaggio sono riservate e ad uso esclusivo del destinatario.
> Qualora il messaggio Le fosse pervenuto per errore La preghiamo di
> eliminarlo
> senza copiarlo, e di non inviarlo a terzi, dandocene gentilmente
> comunicazione.
> Grazie.
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/



-- 
*Ing. Francesco Bianco*
Senior Software Engineer, CRM Solution Architect
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
  email: info.francescobianco at gmail.com
    pec: info.francescobianco at pec.it
   blog: https://medium.com/@yafb
   sito: https://italia.codecrm.org
 social: https://linkedin.com/in/yafb
 mobile: +39 320 0466987
  p.iva: 02360350819

--
Ai sensi del D.L. n° 196 del 30/06/03 si precisa che le informazioni
contenute
in questo messaggio sono riservate e ad uso esclusivo del destinatario.
Qualora il messaggio Le fosse pervenuto per errore La preghiamo di
eliminarlo
senza copiarlo, e di non inviarlo a terzi, dandocene gentilmente
comunicazione.
Grazie.
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