Adam, John<div><br></div><div>Thank you for pouring out all the feedback - we have received it well.</div><div><br></div><div>Having the core-framework (backend) consistent to standards is on the</div><div>roadmap - will make it in a major release (post Vtiger 6).</div>
<div><br></div><div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:13.333333969116211px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">I can only assume that the management feel that if people try it, and<br>
</span><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:13.333333969116211px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">like it, but are frustrated with things, they will pay for the full service.</span></blockquote>
<div><br></div><div>Sorry, this assumption - does not apply for us.</div></div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">Sorry, but many prospective clients looking round here would probably<br></span><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">shoot themselves before signing up.</span></blockquote>
<div><br></div><div>We are committed make product better - I'm sure this is certainly what is important for all.</div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>Prasad</div><div><br clear="all"><div><span style="border-collapse:collapse;font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><b>Connect with us on: </b><a href="http://twitter.com/vtigercrm" style="color:rgb(0,0,204)" target="_blank">Twitter</a> <b>I</b> <a href="http://www.facebook.com/pages/vtiger/226866697333578?sk=wall" style="color:rgb(0,0,204)" target="_blank">Facebook</a> <b>I</b> <a href="http://blog.vtiger.com/" style="color:rgb(0,0,204)" target="_blank">Blog</a><b> I</b> <a href="http://wiki.vtiger.com/index.php/Main_Page" style="color:rgb(0,0,204)" target="_blank">Wiki</a> <b>I </b><a href="http://forums.vtiger.com/" style="color:rgb(0,0,204)" target="_blank">Forums </a><b>I</b> <a href="http://vtiger.com/" style="color:rgb(0,0,204)" target="_blank">Website</a></span></div>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 1:32 AM, John Crisp <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:john@reetspetit.net" target="_blank">john@reetspetit.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div>On 17/04/13 19:40, Adam Heinz wrote:<br>
> On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Adam Heinz <<a href="mailto:amh@metricwise.net" target="_blank">amh@metricwise.net</a><br>
</div><div>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:amh@metricwise.net" target="_blank">amh@metricwise.net</a>>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> Instead I get crickets and dust.<br>
><br>
><br>
> Since I've had a week to cool off with no response,<br>
<br>
</div>Only a week ? :-)<br>
<div><br>
> I thought I'd add to<br>
> my list of projects to improve developer experience:<br>
><br>
<br>
</div>And user experience too....<br>
<div><br>
> - Booleans in the database should be TINYINT(1), with 1 = true and 0<br>
> false, not the current confusing mix.<br>
> - Replace custom vt_DateTime and DateTimeField classes with integer time<br>
> or core PHP DateTime class. Code is like makeup; less is more. This is<br>
> part of a larger problem of too much code. Please please please use<br>
> Zend or PEAR or ADOdb or any of the other common frameworks that have<br>
> thousands of users and their own development teams and years of working<br>
> proof and take all that work off of your plate. You've spent a year<br>
> implementing your own custom MVC -- now you get to maintain it and<br>
> you've lost all that time. I'm half inclined to see if I can implement<br>
> Zend Framework MVC in a weekend that is backwards compatible with<br>
> existing files.<br>
> - When you push code to the public svn, push it as individual change<br>
> sets so that developers can backport patches to old version, or get a<br>
> better understanding of why things are built the way they are. Better<br>
> yet, work in the public svn and merge fixes into your hidden OnDemand<br>
> branch. If you do that, developers can give you timely feedback on your<br>
> changes -- or maybe even help with the implementation. The same is true<br>
> of Trac -- bugs should be closed as they are fixed and the code should<br>
> be visible and linked from the bug at that time.<br>
><br>
><br>
<br>
</div>I'm no developer, but I couldn't agree more.<br>
<br>
Even I can pull in the odd change from svn, but as I have said before,<br>
the whole 'fixes' thing at the minute is a complete disaster area. Quite<br>
frankly, and being perfectly honest if a little blunt, it sucks.<br>
<br>
I am fortunate in that by and large, and excepting the odd minor hack,<br>
vTiger does what we want as is. If I had a larger organisation I would<br>
be looking elsewhere for a CRM.....<br>
<br>
Will vTiger ever get the fact that they have a willing community that<br>
would love to be more involved which they by and large ignore, or at<br>
best pay lip service too ? How many times do we see keen new<br>
individuals arrive, only to get more and more frustrated when they are<br>
ignored, and then leave ???<br>
<br>
(I am currently kind of leading SME server/<a href="http://contibs.org" target="_blank">contibs.org</a> and we have<br>
similar malaises that we are trying to cure)<br>
<br>
This is not an attack on vTiger individuals as there are many well<br>
meaning guys. But you just feel their hands are tied with an invisible cord.<br>
<br>
As I have said so often. vTiger is great. It could be SO much greater.<br>
<br>
But for reason or reasons unknown to us all the powers that be still<br>
choose to ignore everyone and carry on as they are. The profits must be<br>
good somewhere.....<br>
<br>
I can only assume that the management feel that if people try it, and<br>
like it, but are frustrated with things, they will pay for the full service.<br>
<br>
Sorry, but many prospective clients looking round here would probably<br>
shoot themselves before signing up.<br>
<br>
The community is the vTiger advertising board, and from where I sit, it<br>
doesn't look good. You might sign some customers, but how many silently<br>
walk away ????<br>
<br>
So please vTiger, listen to the words of Adam and other top developers.<br>
They ARE right. Give them a chance to help make vTiger the best there is.<br>
<br>
B. Rgds<br>
John<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
<a href="http://www.vtiger.com/" target="_blank">http://www.vtiger.com/</a><br>
</blockquote></div><br></div>