<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"><html><head><meta content="text/html;charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"></head><body >I agree with you Matt. I will post a separate mail to have the private forkers to have their codes submitted for integration to whichever trunk needed.
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<br>Richie<br><br><br><br><br>---- Matthew Brichacek<mmbrich@fosslabs.com> wrote ---- <br><br><blockquote style='border-left: 2px solid #0000FF; padding: 6px;'><html>
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On Wed, 2006-07-12 at 10:48 -0300, Sergio A. Kessler wrote:<br>> Mat,<br>> <br>> v4.x would not be abandoned while there is people interested in<br>> maintaining it, that's all needed in open source, interested and<br>> executive people...<br>> it can be mantained forever while this condition is met...<br>It could, but I just don't see it happening after 5.x is stable and<br>usable. This is just my opinion based on past experience.<br><br>> <br>> and I agree with you that there was (is ?) an utterly lack of<br>> receptive response to community developers from the core team, and the<br>> project was crying for a fork, but all those people creating private<br>> forks also lacked the balls to create a serious *public* fork...<br>> <br>> I mean, if you are going to fork, then fork in all it's glory...<br>Because maintaining a proper OSS project with little to no support from<br>the community (and abandoning the core team) is no small task, esp. when<br>the boss is breathing down your neck to get X,Y,Z features enabled ASAP.<br>Other things.. the community was building quickly, features were<br>storming into the forums (even though they didn't get used) and the code<br>was a complete cluster fuck. The pros of a fork barely outweighed the<br>benefits and for mere mortal to come along and try to tackle it would<br>have been near suicidal.<br>Also, in some cases the choice to fork may have been the career saving<br>moment after the boss found out you decided to deploy the company on<br>project that was abandoned over night with no warning or word of upgrade<br>paths, bug fixes, etc.<br><br>> <br>> those people that never submitted a patch, never figthed for more open<br>> development, created their own private branch, and then came up here<br>> whining, are ... well, whiners IMO<br>Most of them did submit patches and fought for more open development and<br>when they were ignored simply took their patches and went home. Some of<br>us were a little more vocal about it but the only reason that worked is<br>because the critical mass needed to make a real change had already built<br>up from the people who came before us.<br>This really was my point in the last thread. I would normally agree<br>with you 100% on this issue but I think this project had a period where<br>there was a sign on the front door saying "Open for business..<br>Developers Welcome.. and Trespassers will be ignored (or shot)" all in<br>the same breath.<br><br>> <br>> those who want to mantain v4.x just need to step up and do something about it...<br>My argument wasn't really for 4.x maint. I think the current<br>maintainers are doing a fine job of keeping the release afloat for the<br>community (no thanks to me mind you). My point was that we should find<br>a way to welcome these wayward forks back to the fold. How? I dunno..<br>but I think it's worth investigating as I am pretty sure that many many<br>private vtiger4.x forks are floating about. Personally I am going<br>gangbusters to try and get all of our 4.x features into 5.x since I<br>despise being forked from a project but asking all of these integrators<br>to do that is not nice, nor is it standard operating procedure for an<br>OSS project.. I firmly believe that much less of this would have<br>happened if this project was following a true OSS format during the 4.x<br>devel and hadn't gone off half-cocked to start 5.x. Do I think 5.x was<br>worth the wait and headache of what happened to 4.x? Not even remotely<br>close, we could have added smarty, campaigns and all the AJAX fluff to<br>4.x in less time IMO.<br><br>So after the wind clears.. my point really comes down to getting all<br>these folks who are working on private forks to come back to the<br>community project, regardless of their justification (or lack of) for<br>the fork. In an OSS project your most valuable resource is your<br>developers and if we can find a way to get them back it will be well<br>worth it IMHO.<br><br><br>Matt<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Get started with creating presentations online - <a href="http://zohoshow.com?vt">http://zohoshow.com?vt</a> <br>
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