<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"><html><head><meta content="text/html;charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"></head><body >Team, I am not sure if we do have a plan in place to have the list management part in. No doubt it can be done but the overall goal will be to have a logical flow in the system to use the feature which I suspect can be achieved at such short notice. Saint too has to be brought into the picture and he needs time to evaluate and suggest a flow. Then, comes the UI deliverables and the testing, bug-fixing,etc.
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<br>I personally like the feature, in fact, what Matt has said is the proper way in which the feature should be provided. I do concede that the campaign management feature is as of now, more a place holder than anything.
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<br>But, I am not sure if this is the right time to get this in. The Beta is just round the corner and we are better off testing whatever we have.
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<br>Just for the info, I have asked Matt for the estimate for getting this feature in though but I am not in favour of adding any new features at this juncture.
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<br>Your views are welcome.
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<br>Richie<br><br><br><br><br>---- Matthew Brichacek<mmbrich@fosslabs.com> wrote ---- <br><br><blockquote style='border-left: 2px solid #0000FF; padding: 6px;'><html>
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This is true, I've been known to change my mind before :) .. but this is<br>something I really want to get moved into 5.x for my own benefit as well<br>(because all you hackers are going to make it better than I ever<br>imagined right?), on the other hand though I will surely introduce some<br>bugs with this feature and that's not what feature freezes are for ;).<br><br>Anyways, if there is enough agreement in how list management should be<br>done I'm willing to merge it in now if Richie still allows. I am still<br>not sure how to tackle the list management though, I want to improve on<br>how I did it for 4.x but haven't come up with any ideas on just how to<br>do that yet.<br><br>Matt<br><br>On Tue, 2006-05-23 at 18:02 -0300, Sergio A. Kessler wrote:<br>> I'm afraid that if you let pass this windows (as you say, richie<br>> opened you a windows) while you are with this thing with the hot<br>> hands, in the future things could cold and maybe you decide that's not<br>> worth the effort...<br>> <br>> +1<br>> <br>> /sak<br>> <br>> On 5/23/06, Matthew Brichacek <mmbrich@fosslabs.com> wrote:<br>> > I'm not real sure what Richies plan is moving forward, he wrote me this<br>> > AM and asked me to put the email tracking stuff in but I declined<br>> > because we are still in feature freeze and because I wanted opinions on<br>> > list management (not to mention I am still busy with webmails stuff).<br>> ><br>> > So IOW, I dunno, if I get the thumbs up to add it to v5 then I will,<br>> > otherwise I will wait until the next window opens up and do what I can<br>> > to merge it in then.<br>> ><br>> > As far as list management, we're on the same page, currently if the user<br>> > clicks on the "Unsubscribe from all campaigns" link in the unsub page<br>> > they will have the contactdetails.emailoptout flag set and never be<br>> > emailed again from vtiger.<br>> ><br>> ><br>> > Matt<br>> ><br>> > On Tue, 2006-05-23 at 16:23 -0300, Sergio A. Kessler wrote:<br>> > > Matthew, I think the email flag by campaign is rigth,<br>> > > maybe the contactdetails.emailoptout could be used for 'never ever<br>> > > email this guy'<br>> > ><br>> > > btw, this is going in v5 ? or is is too late ?<br>> > ><br>> > ><br>> > > /sak<br>> > ><br>> > > On 5/23/06, Matthew Brichacek <mmbrich@fosslabs.com> wrote:<br>> > > > Hello All,<br>> > > ><br>> > > > I'll be getting ready to drop the email tracking capabilities into 5.x<br>> > > > soon and I would like peoples opinions on list management...<br>> > > ><br>> > > > In our current deployment we've created an abstracted list management<br>> > > > system called the "Campaigns" module.. Imagine that :). Within this<br>> > > > module I track all lists by the parent_id and not by entity. This is<br>> > > > because some of our customers are large telemarketing organizations and<br>> > > > wanted to be able to harvest lists from their leads DB and re-call them<br>> > > > even if they had a previous do-not-call flag set from another campaign.<br>> > > > There are other good reasons for list management too, I'll explain more<br>> > > > bellow.<br>> > > ><br>> > > > I tied the list management into the custom views module, IE: if you<br>> > > > create a custom view called "List 1" you will have a campaign created<br>> > > > with a parent id == customviewid of List 1. The parent is where the<br>> > > > tracking begins at so that if the list is simply duplicated (say for<br>> > > > another newsletter) then the unsub list is maintained. If a new custom<br>> > > > view is created, the parent_id is set to the new customviewid for the<br>> > > > new campaign and the list unsubs are reset.<br>> > > ><br>> > > > I know that is confusing but it enforces list management and not at the<br>> > > > entity level so it still allows for harvesting new lists from the db.<br>> > > > Here is a simple scenario of how it works:<br>> > > > 1) I create a custom view called "sales list" and click the "Add to<br>> > > > Campaigns" checkbox and save it.<br>> > > > 2) A new campaign with a subject of "Initial list creation" is created<br>> > > > with a parent_id == cvid of "Sales List"<br>> > > > 3) Set the campaign type == "Email" and the rest of the fields to<br>> > > > whatever I want and save<br>> > > > 4) New button appears in Campaign DetaiView for "Create/Edit Email" and<br>> > > > "Bulk Mail". I create an email and mail it.<br>> > > ><br>> > > > Now, suppose one of my customers unsubs from this list. He won't ever<br>> > > > be emailed from the "Sales List" or any of the children campaigns that<br>> > > > are created from it. However, if I go create a "Newsletter List" custom<br>> > > > view and add it to the campaigns that customer _will_ be mailed again.<br>> > > > Using the regular contactdetails.emailoptout would have stopped that<br>> > > > customer from getting the newsletter list and is another good reason for<br>> > > > list management instead of entity management for campaigns.<br>> > > ><br>> > > > So, what do you think? Far too complicated? Would you like to see a<br>> > > > stricter set of unsub management rules? Or do you think this mix is<br>> > > > just right?<br>> > > ><br>> > > > If you need further explanation just say so.<br>> > > ><br>> > > > Matt<br>> > > ><br>> > > > _______________________________________________<br>> > > > This vtiger.com email is sponsored by Zoho Planner. Still scribbling down your To-Do's on bits of paper & palms of your hands? Try the AJAX enabled, personal organizer online, Zoho Planner for FREE instead! <a href="http://zohoplanner.com/?vt">http://zohoplanner.com/?vt</a><br>> > > ><br>> > ><br>> > > _______________________________________________<br>> > > This vtiger.com email is sponsored by Zoho Planner. Still scribbling down your To-Do's on bits of paper & palms of your hands? Try the AJAX enabled, personal organizer online, Zoho Planner for FREE instead! <a href="http://zohoplanner.com/?vt">http://zohoplanner.com/?vt</a><br>> ><br>> > _______________________________________________<br>> > This vtiger.com email is sponsored by Zoho Planner. Still scribbling down your To-Do's on bits of paper & palms of your hands? Try the AJAX enabled, personal organizer online, Zoho Planner for FREE instead! <a href="http://zohoplanner.com/?vt">http://zohoplanner.com/?vt</a><br>> ><br>> <br>> _______________________________________________<br>> This vtiger.com email is sponsored by Zoho Planner. Still scribbling down your To-Do's on bits of paper & palms of your hands? Try the AJAX enabled, personal organizer online, Zoho Planner for FREE instead! <a href="http://zohoplanner.com/?vt">http://zohoplanner.com/?vt</a> <br><br>_______________________________________________<br>This vtiger.com email is sponsored by Zoho Planner. Still scribbling down your To-Do's on bits of paper & palms of your hands? Try the AJAX enabled, personal organizer online, Zoho Planner for FREE instead! <a href="http://zohoplanner.com/?vt">http://zohoplanner.com/?vt</a> <br>
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