[Vtigercrm-developers] New free responsive template for vtiger 6 with installer

Sun Aug 9 12:08:33 GMT 2015

Simone, 

I don't want you to get me wrong, this is only my point of view and as
you know some strange ideas sometimes pop into my mind. Creating a good
template for Vtiger is a very long and difficult task. What you're doing
is laudable and some people will benefit from it, but I have a few
comments. Below I presented some important points:

1. Is it possible to create a very good template without cooperating
with the producer?

In case of Vtiger it's not possible, or perhaps not reasonable. First
you have to convince Vtiger to allow the possibility of supporting
multiple templates without modifying system files, you already have a
ready solution for your template, and this change is a matter of a few
minor changes, so it will be easier to convince them. Of course, the
level of cooperation between you and Vtiger has to increase. 

2. Is this the right moment to create a template for Vtiger 6.3? 

You've already created it so the question was posted certainly too late.
If I remember correctly, Vtiger informed about their intent to update
Bootstrap at the end of December 2015 [I might be wrong]. The question
should be directed to Vtiger, whether or not they will update bootstrap
[or update the logic of building templates in any other way], if so,
then all your work is in vain. 

3. Is this the right time from a technical perspective?

Despite the fact that Vtiger 6.3 is in many ways better than Vtiger 5.4,
it also has many imperfections. One of them is an outdated bootstrap
library, which is the basic library for templates. They made a huge
mistake modifying bootstrap library's system files for their own needs
while designing Vtiger 6.

Currently if you create any kind of a template you are doomed to use the
older version of bootstrap, which can't be updated easily, therefore
creating a modern template for the old library versions is not an
optimal solution. The process of updating the library itself is very
laborious, so upgrading your system should be divided into three steps:

a). Upgrading libraries [also javascript libraries associated with
bootstrap or libraries that are part of Vtiger]
b). Improving all templates, so that they are compatible with standards
such as WCAG 2.0, HTML5, CSS3 [which sometimes involves changing the way
of generating data to tpl]
c). Building a new template, completely separated from the engine,
compatible with the newest standards.

We finished the first step, the biggest challenge was to update all all
javascript libraries. Interestingly, some of the necessary libraries are
not ready yet for production use, a great example of that is the select2
library [https://github.com/select2/select2/issues [7] ], which at the
moment has 370 opened issues and most likely even more of the unreported
ones. It took many days for us to fix the imperfect libraries, and the
process itself is much more laborious than it seems. 

4. What if we ignore bootstrap and create a new template?

As a matter of fact you are at this stage right now. It results
primarily from the lack of support from Vtiger, so you're in a difficult
position. Additionally you don't have the possibility to change the
engine [you do have this possibility but apparently you don't want to
change the system files - according the principle "the fewer changes in
the engine the better" - and rightly so]. However, your current
situation causes you to make the same mistakes Vtiger made:

a). Translations are made incorrectly by "gluing" words together.
b). The incorrect interface elements aren't changed
c). tpl files are incorrectly built [the elements that should be places
in separate css files are in side html]
d). The created template doesn't correspond to any standards of building
interface such as HTML5, CSS3, WCAG2, UX.
e). The created interface is less refined than its imperfect default
version.
f). The interface isn't really responsive [ I don't know on what basis
you claim so]

I know there will be people who will say they like your solution more
than the default solution - everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
The truth [in my opinion] is that taking into consideration UX and
practical terms, this template is no different at all, it is just less
refined - it hasn't been tested enough. In case of the customer's
portal, you literally concentrated on the quantity, not on the quality
[not sure whether it was you or someone else who created these
templates]. You've created a lot of imperfect templates that don't
really introduce anything innovative.

5. Can you do something well and make some profit from it? 

I've seen a lot of interfaces, some of them are really good, look at
this one:
http://www.keenthemes.com/preview/metronic/theme/templates/admin/ [8] ;
every element of the system was carefully refined and thought through.
Creating a template like this one [it costs $27 and was sold more than
30 thousand times] requires several people to work on it for several
weeks. 
If something is supposed to be well done, it will require resources,
time, and vision.
Of course, complaining is easy, but building something is harder. We
create a new interface on our own and we know how many weeks of hard
work await us. We can gladly pay $2000 - $4000 to someone to take care
of the "coding" part for us, even though I know it would actually cost 2
or even 3 times more [a graphic designer, a designer, programmers who
will improve the system]. The initial version of the interface can be
found here:https://github.com/YetiForceCompany/YetiForceCRM/issues/1385
[9] 

6. How should we live?

I can see here a major problem related to open source [Vtiger], I'd sum
it up by saying: a lot of people who focus on the same project can't
cooperate well enough, so as not to double each other's work, make the
same mistakes, and create semi-finished products.

This problem doesn't only concern you, it's a general problem, and it
affects just about everyone focused on Vtiger [also YetiForce, coreBOS,
VTE]. The producer [Vtiger] negatively affects the whole situation by
not continuing to develop open source versions; as well as all the
commercially oriented companies [e.g. VTExperts] that create
semi-finished products, or products that should be part of the system,
available for everyone. 

7. To sum up

In my opinion the way you chose to create your own template for Vtiger
is very long, expensive, and laborious; and to make it worse you are now
alone. The question is whether or not it's the right direction, whether
from the perspective of the next 2-3 years you' ll be be satisfied with
the results. I hope so, I'm probably the only person to have such lofty
ideas ;P 
---

Z poważaniem / Regards 

BŁAŻEJ PABISZCZAK 
_Chief Executive Officer_ 
M: +48.884999123
E: b.pabiszczak at yetiforce.com 

W dniu 2015-07-28 17:03, Simone Travaglini napisał(a): 

> Hello guys,
> we are proud to announce the relase of our free responsive template for Vtiger 6.
> The biggest advantages of the responsive template GENIUS TEMPLATE are:
> -Using vTiger 6 from mobile devices (smartphone and tablet).
> -New modern graphic even from desktop.
> -New icons for each module.
> -Click to call from mobile
> 
> All info and download page here:
> http://www.genius-crm.com/vtiger-resources/vtiger-add-on/genius-theme-free-responsive-template-for-vtiger-6 [1]
> 
> Github for developer that want to contribute here (only template, not installer):
> https://github.com/genius-crm/Template-responsive [2]
> 
> Contributor:
> http://www.crmready.it/ [3]
> http://www.greencrm.it [4]
> http://www.opencrmitalia.com [5]
> 
> -- 
> 
> Simone Travaglini
> 328 5499846
> Linkedin: Simone Travaglini 
> 
> Rispetta l'ambiente: non stampare questa mail se non ti è veramente necessario! 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.vtiger.com/ [6]

Links:
------
[1]
http://www.genius-crm.com/vtiger-resources/vtiger-add-on/genius-theme-free-responsive-template-for-vtiger-6
[2] https://github.com/genius-crm/Template-responsive
[3] http://www.crmready.it/
[4] http://www.greencrm.it
[5] http://www.opencrmitalia.com
[6] http://www.vtiger.com/
[7] https://github.com/select2/select2/issues
[8] http://www.keenthemes.com/preview/metronic/theme/templates/admin/
[9] https://github.com/YetiForceCompany/YetiForceCRM/issues/1385
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